Let's talk about gun control.

[tabbiewolf]

My heart goes out to all the folks in Newtown today who lost loved ones in the shooting. Especially all the parents of the young children…I cannot imagine having Christmas gifts wrapped and ready to go under the tree and losing the people who were going to open them, whose lives had barely started. My heart breaks at the thought (and I don't even like kids all that much).

So.

Let's talk about gun control.

No, I'm not going to not talk about it. The "let's wait a bit, it's disrespectful to do it now" thing is bullshit. A couple days ago someone shot up a mall. Not long before that, a movie theater. Now we have an entire class of kids -- KIDS! Little kids who are not even ten years old yet! Kids who have not had time to become cynical! -- dead because of guns and we're still refusing to talk about it? No. We're going to fucking talk about it.

Here's an amazing thing: I want more gun control in this country. This does not mean I want to take your gun away. I know, this is a crazy concept.

If you use your gun for hunting or a hobby -- skeet shooting or something similar -- I'm totally cool with that. Heck, if you have a gun in your bedside table that you keep around because it makes you feel safer, I'm cool with that. If you have a collection of firearms that you are keeping because you are waiting until the next revolution/the rise of the Antichrist/Ragnarok, I think you are a bit crazy and we're going to talk about that here.

I believe that gun owners should be required to pass some sort of mental health requirement every six months. Frankly, having seen mental health issues exhibited in people (and knowing one person who basically is a manipulative psychopath go through half a dozen psychologists before someone pinged on it), every quarter would be better, but every six months is a fair middle ground. I also think that if you own a gun, it should be used at least once a year -- again, I think at least once every six months is better in all honesty -- for hobby stuff, hunting, or simply practice in using it. I honestly have no idea if shooting a gun is like riding a bicycle, but I would assume that keeping up in practice is not a bad thing…especially if you're a hobbyist or hunter.

Do I think there should be a limit on the amount of guns people keep? Well, yes, actually, but that's personal opinion. I doubt this is something we could control, and it'd become one of those "when guns are outlawed only outlaws will have guns" bumper sticker arguments. But I think if the requirement of regular use every six months or year was maintained, situations where people are building their own militias in their basement may just mellow out a bit. Maybe. It's hard to keep hope in humanity these days.

Someone, I'm sure, will bring up the "Well, cars kill people a lot more often than guns do…should people have to take tests every 6 months to drive?" Ignoring the fact that we have to renew our licenses pretty often, and that some states do have a not-quite-yearly testing requirement (Arizona has one for senior citizens, I know this from living there, so that folks who are going blind or have Alzheimers will not be permitted to drive when it seems like they really shouldn't), cars were not designed specifically to kill people. Neither was alcohol or drugs (well, most kinds of recreational drugs, anyway). Guns were designed for one purpose: to injure and kill. Be it an animal, a person, or just a clay disc, their purpose is for destruction. And I think that if you want to be able to own something with the single purpose of destruction, you should have to prove that you are mentally healthy and capable of owning such an item.

This is just an idea, mind you, a personal concept that I came up with this morning after hearing of the incident. What does everyone here think? More importantly, what do you think we should do? And don't say "We can't change anything" because we are the only ones who can change anything, and being quiet about it will not do a damn thing.

Comments

[fenris-lorsrai.livejournal.com]

The part that always gets forgotten in the argument over the 2nd ammndment is that it it's right to bear arms AS PART OF A WELL REGULATED MILITIA.

as written:
"A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."

The laws we have seem to have almost entirely forgotten that it is contingent upon you being in the militia. The point of bearing arms was that you could be called up to serve and be counted on to be a decent enough shot you would hit what you were aiming at. so regular training AND INSPECTION at militia practice was assumed to go with it.

[linda-a.livejournal.com]

I totally agree with controls on guns.

I am refraining from politicizing this issue today, only because I am just incensed by the number of people on my facebook friends list who are, for some reason, treating it as an opportunity to take cheap shots at the president/government.

This was clearly a random act of senseless violence. I totally agree with the mental health requirement for buying guns.

I also think that treatment of mental health issues must be improved. Stigma of mental illness needs to be removed so people are not afraid to get treated. I don't know how much of a difference it could make, but it's certainly a start.

[anjel-kitty.livejournal.com]

I totally agree. Gun control and regulation needs to change in this country. We can't just keep allowing this to happen over and over again and not think that there is something in our culture that is influencing this that we can't do anything about.

[foxx278.livejournal.com]

Best set of ideas ever heard. I'm glad someone's wanting to take a stand and actually talk about gun control. It makes no sense not to and then we let all these shootings happen. Maybe this one will get people to wake up since it occurred at an elementary school and a significantly high number of children's lives were taken in this shooting. It's one thing if most of the targets were adults, but children...that's where the line needs to be drawn.

[kowe]

Arizona has one for the senior citizens yes, but when Adam went to go get his just last week, his driver's license doesn't expire til 2049! He's 28, it won't expire for another 37 years. Doesn't quite seem fair, honestly. Everyone, regardless of age, should have to retest if they've had a certain number of accidents or what have you.

[world-dancer.livejournal.com]

I've been saying for a while now that I want to see the "militia" part of the amendment enforced. If you own a gun, you should be required for licensing purposes to train under the supervision of the "authorities" in my mind police, but it can be the local ROTC. Whatever floats your boat. Anyway, train 4 times per year.

This gets you out. This means you have to be around other people with guns. It means you have to learn to properly use your gun. It means other people see you using your gun. It means some professionals get a chance to see you and decide if you need an additional psych evaluation. It means that if you use your gun improperly, you've personally disappointed a support network of people you're familiar with.

Additionally, were we to be invaded, it would mean that you had a plan. That they couldn't just easily round everyone up by going house to house and individually taking your guns, you would have a whole group of people with guns working together, which was rather the whole point of the second amendment in the first place.

[dalesql.livejournal.com]

I think that we should do what they did in Israel to deal with mass school shootings. Back in the 70s and 80s, Israel had a real problem with terrorists breaking into schools and killing everyone who they could catch. Many instances of this. Israel then changed their laws to allow the adult school staff people to go get their concealed firearms licenses, some tactical training, and IIRC, parental volunteers to undergo the same screening and training to act as additional on-site security staff. Teachers were not required to be armed, it was totally voluntary. They also spent the money to strengthen the doors and windows, put good locks on the doors, and create response plans with local police/military units in case of attack.

Since then, the terrorists have stopped attacking schools. Seems they kept getting shot dead while they were trying to break down locked doors. Yes, they did manage to kill some in their subsequent attacks, but far lower dead and wounded numbers. Then they gave up attacking schools. I also haven't heard of a single incident of a authorized armed person in a school committing mass murder in the 40 years since.

Guns are not going away, and crazy people are gonna keep popping up too. (because you pretty much have to be crazy by definition to commit mass murder) They are still going to end up with weapons of some kind. You may not have heard about the school massacre in China the other day. Society with gun control measures way stricter than ever would be tolerated in the US. The perpetrator used a knife. All our gun free school zone laws did today in Connecticut was guarantee that none of the the teachers or staff in that school had anything other than an improvised club and personal heroism to resist a murderer with a gun. I blame the anti-gun activists for creating and perpetuating a disarmed victim zone for a crazy person to exploit.

[tabbiewolf.livejournal.com]

I actually heard about the thing in China, and I find it interesting that you called it a massacre because in the reports I've read, no one actually died. I'm not saying stabbing is better than guns...no, actually I am. I mean, I don't approve of either, but takes a helluvalot more effort to kill someone with a knife than it does with a gun.

Also, the information about Israel you've heard is either false or outdated, and the current information can be read about here (http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2012/12/14/mythbusting-israel-and-switzerland-are-not-gun-toting-utopias/).

Interesting Quote from that Article: "Both countries require you to have a reason to have a gun. There isn’t this idea that you have a right to a gun. You need a reason. And then you need to go back to the permitting authority every six months or so to assure them the reason is still valid."

So, anyway. If you want us to be like Israel and for the government to have MORE CONTROL over guns and who purchases them, I am totally cool with that idea. It is basically the exact same idea I expressed in this post.

I also don't agree with the "being the hero" thing because of the amount of trouble it would cause for the cleanup. What if the hero missed? What if they were then prosecuted as the one who started it...because they'd killed the person who could prove them wrong? Real life isn't like the movies. More importantly, that's a LOT of stress and guilt to put on teachers, leaving out all the other crap that they have to go through. That was one of my possible career choices, and if I knew I'd have to be armed to do it, I wouldn't have even considered it.

I'm not comfortable with the concept of fear running everyone's lives.

[dalesql.livejournal.com]

I restrict myself to only one political post each day, and I replied to someone elses post earlier today, so I'll have to hold off my reply until then. Hope sales go well at pandamonium tomorrow. See you there.

[indeterminist.livejournal.com]

I'd been waiting for more details before replying, and it looks like they are starting to come in.

As far as I'm aware, the shooter was 20 years old and the shooting was with handguns. If both are true, him even possessing them in the first place was already illegal to begin with. There are some sketchy reports that he murdered his mother and took them from her.

Also guns in schools for anybody without explicit written permission is a federal crime outside of a few very limited exceptions (none of which applied here).

The most effective way to prevent this would be having available and affordable mental health treatment for those that need it.

[tabbiewolf.livejournal.com]

I agree with this whole heartedly, but the problem with mental health treatment is that if you truly need it, odds are you don't know you do.

Mental health IS something we don't respect enough in this country, though. It's something your regular doctor should consult with you about every year (or every six months), not just something that's an afterthought when stuff like this happens.